TNL Features - Politics

Andrew Sullivan Crosses the Line

by Benjamin Kerstein

Andrew Sullivan

“How we loved you then,” Jean-Paul Sartre wrote of Albert Camus during their acrimonious split in 1952. This simple but deeply sad phrase sprang to mind the other day when I was informed of Andrew Sullivan’s latest descent into unreason. The occasion was, of course, Sarah Palin’s new book; and Sullivan’s missive went, in part, like this:

This is only the second time in its nearly ten-year history that the Dish has gone silent. The reason now is the same as the reason then. When dealing with a delusional fantasist like Sarah Palin, it takes time to absorb and make sense of the various competing narratives that she tells about her life…. She is a deeply disturbed person which makes this work of fiction and fact all the more challenging to read. And the fact that she is now the leader of the Republican party and a potential presidential candidate, makes this process of deconstruction an important civil responsibility.

As many, including myself, expected, this “deconstruction” was in fact driven by what Sullivan called Palin’s “fantastic story of her fifth pregnancy”; that is, Sullivan’s conspiracy theory that Sarah Palin faked her pregnancy and the child known as Trig is actually someone else’s, most likely one of her daughters.

Many others have had their fun commenting on Sullivan’s slow immigration to the land of the bizarre. Even one of his own co-writers appears to be less than comfortable with the direction he has been taking, saying, “I strongly believe that there is nothing to this story.” And one could simply dismiss all of this as yet another symptom of the liberal derangement surrounding the figure of Sarah Palin. For me, however, the entire pageant of Sullivan’s precipitous journey to the edge of sanity cannot arouse anything other than a sense of tragedy and even, perhaps, pity.

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I do not know him personally, but like many other people who write about politics for a living—especially online, and especially on the right of the political spectrum—I owe Andrew Sullivan a thing or two. Back in the heady days after 9/11, when I was just another struggling young blogger, Sullivan provided me with some very welcome and very generous links to his wildly popular blog. Without them, I would not have been noticed by the editorial staff of a Jerusalem political and cultural journal; I would not have eventually been hired as their assistant editor; and I would have been noticed, hired, and published by the website you are reading now. I will not say that I owe my entire career—such as it is—to Sullivan, but there is no doubt that his willingness to promote and encourage young and unknown writers gave me a start that would have been much more difficult to come by if he had not done so. I know that there are many other writers working today who could say similar things.

In those days, however, there was a great deal more to Sullivan’s appeal than his generosity. It’s easy enough now to forget that, in the immediate aftermath of 9/11, some of the ugliest political rhetoric ever to emerge from the political left seemed to be taking over the zeitgeist faster than anyone could stop it. Academics, journalists, critics, self-appointed experts, and relics of America’s Vietnam-era past were telling us that America deserved what it got, that Israel and the Jews were the cause of it all, that we should embrace our justifiably embittered enemies and convince them of our generosity and goodwill, etc., etc.

Against this collective derangement of the establishment, Sullivan seemed to be a one-man Maginot Line (an unfortunately prophetic comparison, now that I think about it). His blogging was hyperactive, and he seemed to have an uncanny knack for gabbing hold of the latest piece of leftist idiocy and eviscerating it before its authors even knew what had happened. His writing had a clarity, a moral certitude, a sense of humor, and—most importantly—a joy of combat that was infectious. Even his more personal musings seemed to express a kind of knowing embrace of his own weaknesses and eccentricities rather than shallow egomania.

There was also a certain insecurity, a lack of absolutism, about Andrew’s writing that was unquestionably appealing. Unlike some of the saber-rattling rightwingers flying around talk radio and the blogosphere, he was refreshingly non-dogmatic. He was a conservative, and deeply opposed to radical Islam; but he was also an open homosexual, a sufferer from an incurable and likely fatal disease, and seemed determined to emulate his hero Orwell’s unwillingness to allow the psychopathologies of his own side to go unchallenged. He seemed to strive, as Orwell did, to be aware of his own prejudices. Moreover, his political heterodoxy was profoundly welcome to those of us who were convinced that America (as well as Israel, and the West—for want of a better word—in general) was a fine place and worth fighting for, but were not necessarily in sympathy with the entire spectrum of conservative beliefs. We found in Sullivan a model we could emulate and a voice we could try and make our own. His very presence convinced us that, if there was room on the political spectrum for him, there was room for us as well.

Of course, there were always rumors; rumors about his supposedly heroic consumption of soft drugs, his tendency toward hysteria and hyperbole, his inability to separate the political and the personal, and his sometimes unpredictable turns of opinion. I didn’t then, and I don’t now, think that any of these things were necessarily significant, even if true. We all have our vices. Whether they are or were connected to his current decline, I do not and cannot know. What is clear is that, over time, Andrew Sullivan did indeed start to come apart at the seams.

I am not certain at what point it all began to unravel. Certainly, Sullivan’s turn against George W. Bush over the issues of gay marriage and the use of torture played an enormous part. His feeling of disillusionment over the Iraq War (which I share) and his sense of betrayal by the neoconservatives (which I do not share) were certainly major factors as well. But I don’t think there was any one moment at which Sullivan finally crossed the line into derangement. It was a slow accumulation of twists and turns that resulted in an ostensibly libertarian conservative endorsing Barack Obama, demonizing his opposition, and ultimately deciding—against all available evidence—that the former Republican vice presidential candidate is not only politically disagreeable, but a demented, pathologically lying monster who faked the birth of her fifth child.

For me personally, however, the problem was underlined by a confluence of events. Nearly a decade ago, Sullivan sent me an email in which he said that to him the defense of the Jewish people was the defense of humanity itself. A bit maudlin, perhaps, but an encouraging thing to hear in the midst of a very nasty terrorist war. Then, last year, Sullivan hit back at Jonah Goldberg for calling Barack Obama an elitist by saying that Goldberg’s own status as a member of a privileged, moneyed elite made him a hypocrite on the issue. It was an attack that was just vague enough, but I couldn’t help feeling it was Goldberg’s Judaism that Sullivan was talking about. We are taught from a young age to have little faith in the kindness of gentiles. This is often unfair, but over time one learns enough bitter lessons to admit that there is at least something to the idea. Unfortunately, I fear that for me this was one of them.

For everyone else, however, it was Sullivan’s Sarah Palin obsession, or rather the obsession with her fifth child, and whether or not she actually gave birth to it, that marked the end of Sullivan as a serious or even sane writer. This is understandable. To throw out one’s previous principles is sometimes the result of a difficult and honest change in one’s beliefs; to hurl Occam’s Razor, common sense, and basic human decency out the window in favor of an inscrutable personal vendetta is something else entirely.

Why Sullivan has persisted in his conspiracy theory, and why he holds himself to such persistent ridicule for doing so, is a matter for speculation. What is not in question, however, is that the loss of Andrew Sullivan to conspiracy theory and political derangement is nothing to be celebrated. In this age of style over substance and irrational hope over solemn assessment, we need voices like he once had. That voice is gone now — and the saddest thing is, it was silenced by Sullivan himself.

And this, Andrew, is something you do have to answer for. To change your mind was not a betrayal; to express your disillusionment and disappointment was not a betrayal; but to embrace unreason — to gleefully assent to the political psychopathology you once denounced so eloquently — that was a betrayal. In crossing the line between the sane and the mad you yourself once defended, you committed treason against all of us — left and right — who believe in that line, and try to defend it against those who, for the sake of their own fantasies of power and control, would erase it.

Sadly, I doubt very much that, having crossed that line, you will ever find any reason to cross back over again. Goodbye, I suppose, to all that. How we loved you then. How we mourn you now.

Benjamin Kerstein is Senior Writer for The New Ledger.

TNL
  • elgordo
    Andrew Sullivan has become unhinged years ago. I´m not surprised that he attracts people who are unhinged.

    And all the talk about birth certificates - these guys have no sense of irony, no?
  • ctiberius
    The comment thread is slightly more enjoyable than the original article. I'm waiting for someone to bring up Ancient Astronaut theory.
  • kokay
    I was thinking about your rationale for deciding that Andrew Sullivan is descending into madness, and it reminded me of how Bernie Madoff got away with his Ponzi scheme for so long. The scheme was so bold and outrageous that people discounted the warning signs and even the alarms that were raised by several experts. Why wasn't it possible -- because no one could be that brazen! Except, in fact, they could. The scheme depends on an unwillingness to see what is there in plain view, if only you would look. Madoff said it himself -- people didn't believe it even when the evidence was right in front of their noses. Well, guess what. The Emperor Has No Clothes, and The Governor Faked A Pregnancy.

    Do you remember what the whistle-blower, whose warnings about Madoff were ignored, said after the Ponzi scheme was revealed? Something like, "There was no smoking gun but too many things just didn't add up." This is exactly the case with the Sarah Palin birth hoax. I admit that I thought it was just a crazy conspiracy theory at first. But when I deigned to actually look at the facts instead of basing my conclusion on Palin's own claims, the hoax was obvious. I suggest you look at the evidence too, and then eat some humble pie and admit your error.
  • CSBadeaux
    What is the Matrix?
  • usamerican77
    1. Three words belie any claim of Sarah Palin's unwillingness to expose a child to a media circus: Bristol. Palin's. Pregnancy. The former governor is obviously quite willing to "drag" her child into a media circus if needed. It would have been so much easier for her to disprove the Trig theories by producing positive evidence of her claim to being his biological mother: like medical records, a doctor holding a press conference, birth certificates, heck, DNA evidence. If she had done any of that instead of offering us "proof" in the form of her teenaged daughter's pregnancy, we wouldn't be here, a year later, still talking about this.

    2. The photographic evidence against a Sarah Palin pregnancy is overwhelming, and to my mind, certainly creates "reasonable doubt". Enough to warrant all questions on the subject. Questions which the former governor has never answered in a substantive way. Public office means public accountability.

    3. Sarah Palin has very well-documented trouble with the truth. Numerous inaccuracies in her book, ethics charges, the inability to admit she was found to have abused power! I mean, whether or not she likes the group empaneled to determine whether she abused power, she still has to admit their findings. Doesn't she? Nope, she doesn't. I'll never forget that footage of her walking to her campaign bus shouting over the engines something to the effect of: "I'm just glad they didn't find that I abused power..."

    This is why people find her delusional. Denying the findings of the panel is a denial of REALITY. And the inability to differentiate what is true from what is not is the definition of delusion.

    People who deny reality are perfectly okay with being represented by someone who denies reality. So, I can see how Sarah Palin is a perfect candidate for so many people. She truly reflects their inner world. And the rest of us are not going to talk them out of it.
  • CSBadeaux
    Three words belie any claim of Sarah Palin's unwillingness to expose a child to a media circus: Bristol. Palin's. Pregnancy. The former governor is obviously quite willing to "drag" her child into a media circus if needed. It would have been so much easier for her to disprove the Trig theories by producing positive evidence of her claim to being his biological mother: like medical records, a doctor holding a press conference, birth certificates, heck, DNA evidence.

    Let me see if I have you straight here: In order to spare her teenage daughter, she should have made her infant son into a biology lesson. She should have spent time and energy dealing with the sorts of obsessives who, fifteen months later, would be feverishly arguing over that infant's parentage.

    Yup. Seems sane to me.

    If she had done any of that instead of offering us "proof" in the form of her teenaged daughter's pregnancy, we wouldn't be here, a year later, still talking about this.

    This is demonstrably untrue. It is untrue in the same way that the lunatics who insist that President Obama is not an American citizen ("Oh," you're surely thinking, "I'm not like them. I'm right.") say that if he would just produce his original birth certificate, he could put all of this to rest. It's like the 9/11 Truthers and the moon landing truthers and all the other folks suffering just a large enough psychosis to be certain that they've broken the Gnostic barrier, but still holding just enough sanity to realize that they'll seem insane even to themselves if they don't make it falsifiable.

    Put differently, you spent at least a few minutes on an internet comment diligently, patiently, and irrationally trying to explain that Sarah Palin's son is not her son, that this is self-evident, and that if only she'd meet your deranged demands for proof, you'd go away. Thirteen months after she lost her run for the Vice Presidency, months after she resigned as Governor of Alaska, with no political power or prospects to her name. You have made her son into an "it" to do this.

    Nothing would satisfy you, because satisfaction is a rational event.

    The photographic evidence against a Sarah Palin pregnancy is overwhelming, and to my mind, certainly creates "reasonable doubt". Enough to warrant all questions on the subject. Questions which the former governor has never answered in a substantive way. Public office means public accountability.

    Putting to the side how even the original dKos diarist who embarked on this recanted in light of later photographic evidence, and putting to the side the tendentious idea that a public woman must account for her vagina's comings and goings to anonymous internet commenters, by what possible logic could the fact of public office require a mother to prove her maternity?

    Don't answer. That was intended for any rational people reading this.

    I'll never forget that footage of her walking to her campaign bus shouting over the engines something to the effect of: "I'm just glad they didn't find that I abused power..."

    I tell you, steel doesn't melt that way.

    People who deny reality are perfectly okay with being represented by someone who denies reality.

    People who believe they see the true reality that only a select few others do are perfectly okay being represented by those who will take advantage of them. So: Ron Paul or Hopeandchange?

    And the rest of us are not going to talk them out of it.

    Irony, as a friend of mine used to say, is a harsh mistress.
  • kokay
    Andrew Sullivan did what other journalists should do: he saw that there were serious inconsistencies in Sarah Palin's story and, after trying to reconcile them, he found that they persisted. Thus he had to conclude that the story is not credible. Please note that the Anchorage Daily News could not dispel the rumor that Palin is not the biological mother of Trig, even though they assigned a reporter to try to prove her story. The empirical evidence (photos) shows that Palin was not pregnant in March and April 2008; there is no way for a slender 5'2" woman to hide a 6 lb 2 oz baby. In fact it is you who are the irresponsible journalist for not examining all the facts before drawing a conclusion about this. For that, you owe both your readers and Andrew Sullivan an apology. But of course, Sarah Palin is very glad that you are unwilling to really examine the evidence; that lackadaisical journalism is what has gotten her this far, and she would love for folks like you to continue to pass judgment on this situation without bothering to examine the facts.
  • CSBadeaux
    Please note that the Anchorage Daily News could not dispel the rumor that Palin is not the biological mother of Trig, even though they assigned a reporter to try to prove her story.

    They couldn't disprove a negative?

    Why didn't anyone tell us before? Goodness, y'all win.
  • zuzu138ma
    Sarah Palin could have stopped this story a long time ago. She could have produced a birth certificate, had some hospital personnel who were present give statements, and some photos from the hospital presented. But she didn't do any of those things. She also hasn't sued anyone for libel and this story has been alive and well on the web since before the election.

    The alternative to the fake birth story is the story that she actually presented--the wild ride story. This is the story where she started leaking amniotic fluid while in Texas, stayed to give a speech, did not check in with local medical personnel, but instead flew home to Alaska after a stop in Washington, then drove two hours to a small hospital with no high-risk baby facilities, and had to be induced the next morning. If this is true, she endangered that baby's life many times over, as well as her own. The risk of infection is high in a case like that.

    Which story is worse? The fake baby story where she lied to the American people and uses and abuses her baby as a prop for financial and policital gain or the wild ride story where she recklessy endangers the life of that baby and her own (and still uses the baby as a prop for political and financial gain).

    They are both awful in my opinion. The fact that Sarah Palin is still in the news at all makes it necessary that the truth come out. She needs to be exposed and held accountable for her actions. The same goes for those who picked her to be the V.P. candidate.

    Andrew Sullivan is a brave man for going where other main stream journalists refuse to go. I am grateful to him.
  • CSBadeaux
    Sarah Palin could have stopped this story a long time ago. She could have produced a birth certificate, had some hospital personnel who were present give statements, and some photos from the hospital presented. But she didn't do any of those things. She also hasn't sued anyone for libel and this story has been alive and well on the web since before the election.

    You must be one of those people -- Birthers? -- who believe the President isn't an American citizen. Sorry, I left that out of the conspiracy litany.

    I do want to raise a toast to your willingness to drag a child through the mud to slander your political opponents.
  • MrsTarquinBiscuitbarrel
    Thank you for this well-thought-out comment! If Sarah Palin actually had given birth to Trig, she easily could have proven it long ago. She has not. There have been many issues on which I have disagreed with Andrew Sullivan, most notably his support for the war in Iraq. However, he has earned my respect and trust with his research (remember that?) and his diligence. All of the women I know who have given birth have grave doubts about Palin's Trig-tales. Since Sullivan is a gay man who has not fathered a child, he didn't rely on either personal experience or anecdote: He interviewed ten highly experienced OB/GYNs, all of whom told Sullivan that Palin's story was well-nigh unbelievable.

    If Sarah Palin actually DID embark upon the so-called "wild ride"--allegedly eight months pregnant, age forty-four, with a special-needs fetus--she should be smacked for child endangerment. (How could she get on a commercial flight? And why does no one remember her?) And given that Trig needs glasses, hearing aids, intensive therapy to maximize his development, and appears to be getting none of this... why can't SOMEONE be raising Trig, someone who really values a Down syndrome child as more than a prop?
  • CSBadeaux
    I can only conclude that you have no idea what goes into raising a child with Down Syndrome. In fairness, the sorts of people who obsess over this silliness tend to want them preemptively aborted, so you wouldn't have much exposure; nevertheless, your concern and ignorance are noted.
  • I can only conclude that you might need to know what goes into raising a child with DS. Here is a link to the National Down Syndrome Society including the importance of early intervention therapies from birth to 3. http://www.ndss.org/index.php?option=com_conten... I find it hard to believe that they can fit all the equipment and therapists on the bus.

    It's liberal backed social gov't programs like Dept of Social Services that provide ongoing life long care for DS individuals.
  • CSBadeaux
    I assure you, I'm fully aware of what goes into raising such a child. I am mystified that you believe these therapists and equipment -- which is, fortunately, smaller than the mainframes with which you're apparently familiar -- can only be obtained in Alaska; must be used or applied in exactly the same ways daily; or are otherwise somehow not available to the Palins. Again, this suggests that you're using the internet tubes for a brief overview, rather than applying your apparently extensive knowledge of obstetrics and early infancy pediatrics to the issue.

    I'm fully aware that many liberals once showed a commendable attitude to children with birth defects. It's unfortunate that their descendants want them eliminated.
  • so the alternative to faking the pregnancy is that Sarah showed recklessness, selfishness, and bizarre behavior regarding Trigs labor and delivery (google anything on Sarah's wild ride and even read contractions in her own recounting of the events) Questioning a bizarre tale by a person who has been continually exposed as a liar (often by her own words) is not crossing the line.
  • CSBadeaux
    Publicly questioning the parentage of a child with Down Syndrome is.
  • Having downs has nothing to do with this. In fact, it actually makes her "wild ride" even more reckless. She is the one who keeps putting her children in the public eye. For example, why is Piper on tour with her signing autographs instead of being in school and away from this media circus?
  • CSBadeaux
    There is no such thing as "downs," which you apparently realized when you went to lecture me on early childhood therapies about which you know nothing.

    Again, the issue here is your determination to question a developmentally disabled child's parentage so that you can assuage your need for self-abuse while enjoying a one-year hate of a political opponent.
  • A picture is worth a thousand words. I suggest you do some research. Or to make it a bit easier, check out Bree Palin.
  • KarenJ
    Your diatribe about Andrew Sullivan's quest for truth regarding the fake "fifth pregnancy" of Sarah Palin is a textbook example of what most neoconservative bloggers consider discourse:
    personal insults,
    frequent use of words like "so sad" and"derangement",
    references to attitudes toward Judaism, gayness and drug use in a judgmental, sneering, demeaning manner (payback for Rush Limbaugh?)'''

    ...as well as hyperbole in declaring consideration that other bloggers who might actually be right about Palin's cover-up is "treason".

    That's right, crawl back in your hole and pull the garbage can lid back over so you can't "see the light".

    You're placing blind trust in someone who is a cynical user, someone who's perpetrated the biggest con job for nearly two years now, and amazingly has found new ways to further that con, as she campaigns for her book of lies.
  • CSBadeaux
    You didn't actually read anything Mr. Kerstein wrote, did you?
  • Well, Mr Kerstein, that was quite the rant. Went 'over the line' on the personal

    information about Andrew, but .... that it's your rant so thanks for the

    opportunity to get to know YOU as a journalist.

    I don't know what you know, or think you know, about the Trigg/Trick.

    I don't know how many pregnancies you've had either. I suspect none.

    SO, let me clue you in to something that is neither a 'rumour' or an 'old wives

    tale' or even a 'conspiracy talking point'.

    Women who are carrying high risk babies, whose amniotic fluid begins to leak in the

    8th month, do NOT get on a plane from Dallas to Spokane ... then from Spokane to

    Anchorage, then drive an hour to a po-dunk hospital to 'deliver that baby' in a

    hospital that is not equipped for serious neo-natal care.

    NO Doctors of such women, would give the OK to that, either. Not Doctors who are

    doing their job, anyway. Not in today's litigious environment, and ESPECIALLY not

    in the field of Obstetrics.

    NO woman, whose priority is the safety, health and survival of her baby would

    bypass excellent medical care in Dallas, or Spokane, or Anchorage ... to drive to

    a small hospital to give birth to a baby KNOWN to be high risk.

    I don't know who Trigg/Trick's mother is. But I do know this: According to the

    story Sarah Palin has told, she was HIGHLY negligent in the hours preceding the

    birth of her baby. She showed reckless disregard to the needs of this child as well

    as to those OTHER passengers on those two flights.

    I urge you to talk to a few Obstetricians, give them the facts as recounted by

    Sarah Palin, and see how much THEY believe the story of this birth, and their

    opinion on Sarah's Wild Ride to Alaska.

    THEN please, DO inform us all as to their comments.

    Because I, as a woman who HAS given birth, twice, and a grandmother to three

    babies, and an Aunt to several healthy babies, do NOT believe Sarah's story.
  • Well, Mr Kerstein, that was quite the rant. Went 'over the line' on the personal

    information about Andrew, but .... it's your rant so thanks for the

    opportunity to get to know YOU as a journalist.

    I don't know what you know, or think you know, about the Trigg/Trick.

    I don't know how many pregnancies you've had either. I suspect none.

    SO, let me clue you in to something that is neither a 'rumour' or an 'old wives

    tale' or even a 'conspiracy talking point'.

    Women who are carrying high risk babies, whose amniotic fluid begins to leak in the

    8th month, do NOT get on a plane from Dallas to Spokane ... then from Spokane to

    Anchorage, then drive an hour to a po-dunk hospital to 'deliver that baby' in a

    hospital that is not equipped for serious neo-natal care.

    NO Doctors of such women, would give the OK to that, either. Not Doctors who are

    doing their job, anyway. Not in today's litigious environment, and ESPECIALLY not

    in the field of Obstetrics.

    NO woman, whose priority is the safety, health and survival of her baby would

    bypass excellent medical care in Dallas, or Spokane, or Anchorage ... to drive to

    a small hospital to give birth to a baby KNOWN to be high risk.

    I don't know who Trigg/Trick's mother is. But I do know this: According to the

    story Sarah Palin has told, she was HIGHLY negligent in the hours preceding the

    birth of her baby. She showed reckless disregard to the needs of this child as well

    as those of theOTHER passengers on those two flights.

    I urge you to talk to a few Obstetricians, give them the facts as recounted by

    Sarah Palin, and see how much THEY believe the story of this birth, and their

    opinion on Sarah's Wild Ride to Alaska.

    THEN please, DO inform us all as to their comments.

    Because I, as a woman who HAS given birth, twice, and a grandmother to three

    babies, and an Aunt to several healthy babies, do NOT believe Sarah's story.
  • kitcarr
    Stupid. Archivist1000, it's rare to find such stupendously stupid remarks couched in such seemingly reasonable language as your remarks are. It matters not one whit that you happen to be a woman who has given birth twice, not even if you had given birth ten times, twice to Down syndrome babies. What you said is simply stupid. More often than not, the simplest explanation for something is usually the truthful explanation. You just detest Sarah Palin. Admit it.
  • CSBadeaux
    I, as the father of five children, do.
  • hrh
    Andrew Sullivan is smart, savvy and tells it like it is. Palin is not the biological mother of Trig. Too bad the toadies in the corporate media refuse to touch this. They will be working off their shame for a long time when her deception is finally exposed, just as they are now doing the same with their blind acceptance of Cheney administration lies for eight years, especially the invasion and occupation of Iraq.
  • CSBadeaux
    I think it's adorable that you'd go right to Iraq like that.

    Question: Ron Paul, 9/11, moon landing?
  • consciousatlast
    The noted economist, John Kenneth Galbraith once suggested that a successful technique for maintaining power and control is to deny that a power center exists at all. Thus the delusional ideology of the free market hides the true concentration of resources in few hands. I am sorry to say that the writer here attempts such a crafty trick.. If he would examine the extensive research and investigative materials regarding Ms. Palin's supposed 5th pregnancy, he would find that there is, indeed, an issue worth discussing. Instead, he prefers that old, tired dog.. accusing someone of believing in "conspiracy theories." Perhaps the author does not understand that actual conspiracies have actually happened! Are you familiar with the D-Day landing in Normandy ? How about the Manhattan Project? Wait-- have you even given a surprise party ?? This incurious dismissal of possibly covert information as foolish is really an impotent political tool-- meant to close down the discussion. Too late for that my friends, the cat is out of the bag. If you don't notice it scratching at your door--tant pis !
  • CSBadeaux
    Glorious! We always applaud performance art around here. This is simply a masterpiece.

    (You left out the moon landing.)
  • consciousatlast
    The way in which you have responded to my comment here, as well as most others, indicates that you don't wish to discuss the issue. Instead, you cling childishy to a position that you hold uncritically. I sure hope that you don't make important personal decisions using this approach.
  • CSBadeaux
    In fairness, I have a terrible failing: I treat idiotic garbage as mockable, rather than as an intellectually serious exercise. I suffer fools gladly, but only to laugh at them. I'm aware of this shortcoming, but I've never been able to overcome it.

    For what it's worth, I have the same problem when listening to fans of Dr. Ron Paul explain how he'll save the universe; fans of the President explain how he'll keep his promise to set the seas lowering; serious talks about what really happened on September 11, 2001; the mere mention of the Bilderbergers; and breathless exchanges about Sarah Palin's reproductive system.

    Worry not! I take intelligent and/or serious things seriously.
  • consciousatlast
    The noted economist, J.K. Galbraith once suggested that the way power is held by those in charge is to deny that a true power center exists. The ideological delusion of the "free market" thus neatly hides the concentration of resources in a few hands. I am sorry to see a similar brand of illogic in this article. If the author had done an exhaustive examination of the research about Ms. Palin's supposed 5th pregnancy, he would be forced to acknowledge that there is a real issue here. Instead he relies on that tired old dog.."conspiracy theory"... as if actual conspiracies never happen. Truly, have you heard about the D-day invasion ?? Perhaps you are familiar with the Manhattan Project ? I don't think they were widely discussed during their years of planning. Use your brains folks, not your knees.
  • reesie
    Sarah Palin did not give birth to Trig. Check out other Alaskans blogs. Some people know for a FACT that she was not pregnant. If this "fake pregnancy" story is not true, she can always sue, but she won't, because she can't.
  • CSBadeaux
    They observed here uterus at all relevant times?
  • reesie
    Sorry, you are absolutely wrong. Sarah Palin was never pregnant with Trig. If you think this is some conspiracy theory that Andrew Sullivan cooked up, you are wrong. Check out palingates, breepalin and other Alaskans blogs. Another thing, why won't Ms. Palin sue all of these people who know for a FACT that she didn't give birth to Trig. You know why she won't because she will have to produce documentation to prove that she gave birth to him and she cannot.
  • CSBadeaux
    ...or because there's no point in suing the small but significant number of judgment-proof nuts who probably also believe Bush brought down the World Trade Center.
  • akshutterbug
    It's common knowledge in Alaska that Sarah faked her pregnancy, it was no big deal until she started using her adopted child as a massive political prop. Now the gloves are off, she threw too many people under her well painted bus. That was a big mistake when you're trying to hide the biggest political hoax in this countries history
  • CSBadeaux
    It's common knowledge in Alaska that Sarah faked her pregnancy

    I had no idea that Alaska was a state composed purely of obstetricians and midwives who had a hand in Trig Palin's birth.
  • KarenJ
    I had no idea Orly Taitz was a lawyer, either. Surely no lawyer could be that incompetent.

    Getting back to the topic at hand, one doesn't have to be licensed to deliver babies to look at Palin's flat belly March 5, 2008 and declare "we never realized she was pregnant".

    According to an archived story the next day at The Anchorage Daily News, "...staff and press [were] astonished, [said] they had no idea the Republican Governor of Alaska was pregnant."
  • CSBadeaux
    I apologize, I just caught the Orly Taitz reference -- I assumed she was someone in Alaska until I Googled her name.

    From Wikipedia, I've learned she belongs to a different, irrational conspiracy theory than the one to which you subscribe. Are you perhaps trying to engage in a proxy war? Surely there are other places in the Interwebs in which you can engage each other in demands for birth certificates.
  • CSBadeaux
    Well, they were astonished according to the Alaska Daily News. If that many obstetricians were astonished, I really have no retort.
  • drpatois
    I love Andrew Sullivan because he does not "tow a line". Sullivan instead searches for the truth and is always willing to admit and take responsibility when he is wrong. Why does his questioning the veracity of Sarah Palin claiming to be the biological mother of Trig Palin equate to him descending into madness? You are kidding right? What evidence do you have that proves Sarah Palin is the biological mother of Trig Palin? There is plenty of evidence to question her claim yet no one in the mainstream media will touch the story. Palin has unleashed her lawyer on more than one story but never has she unleashed him over the question of Trig's parentage. I applaud Mr. Sullivan for continuing to stand firm, in the face of over the top derision such as this, in his quest for the truth. The truth matters.
  • CSBadeaux
    Ah, the wages of madness.

    What evidence do you have that proves Sarah Palin is the biological mother of Trig Palin?

    Putting aside that in this wacky society of ours, we take things like a woman's claim of maternity at face value for a thousand reasons (what proof do you have -- and will share here -- that your "mother" is your mother?), this puts the burden in precisely the wrong place. Unless Dr. Sullivan has some sort of affirmative proof other than his years of obstetrics practice that Trig Palin is actually Trig Johnson or Trig Mohammed or Trig Jingleheimerschmidt, then he is indeed on a search for truth unknown since the last attempt to wait out the Hale-Bopp comet.

    Palin has unleashed her lawyer on more than one story but never has she unleashed him over the question of Trig's parentage.

    Yeah, it's like she doesn't like dragging her child into a media frenzy. Oh, I'm sorry: By mentioning her child in speeches, she made him a legitimate hate object, just like when Bill Clinton would talk about his daughter, then bask in the claims she was not his.

    I applaud Mr. Sullivan for continuing to stand firm, in the face of over the top derision such as this, in his quest for the truth. The truth matters.

    There are so many underlying assumptions here that suggest the need for a sincere self-examination, it boggles the mind.
  • KarenJ
    ...we take things like a woman's claim of maternity at face value for a thousand reasons...

    But when the woman's own aides and advisors and political peers couldn't tell she was "pregnant" when she was allegedly 7 months along when she was very plainly pregnant as evidenced by photos of her first and fourth pregnancies...and airline staff both prior to and on the flights of April 17, 2008 could not discern a stage of pregnancy only hours before she allegedly "delivered"...

    ...It's much more likely that either the woman herself is mad, as you put it, or running a remarkable scam -- and not very likely that the rest of the world is mad, who had the temerity to question her then and are still questioning her version of events.

    -----------

    ...by mentioning her child in speeches, she made him a legitimate hate object...

    Your perception of this attitude is as wrongheaded as your dismissal of the illogic of Palin's "pregnancy" behavior.

    The universal attitude of those who have persistently questioned Palin's "fifth birth story" is that Trig is an innocent pawn who's been subjected to abusive and careless treatment considering his precarious health: frequent plane flights, minimal therapy, bright hot lights, late nights and crowds, being awakened to make appearances in cold outdoor conditions dressed in only a shirt and diaper, allowed to walk on spittled and pebbled pavement as happened a couple of days ago...

    Our hearts go out to that poor child.

    It's the tendency of people like you to "project" your attitude toward unfortunates like Trig, as well as the homeless, the helpless, and the needy, by saying we who disagree with you "hate".
  • CSBadeaux
    It's much more likely that either the woman herself is mad, as you put it, or running a remarkable scam -- and not very likely that the rest of the world is mad, who had the temerity to question her then and are still questioning her version of events.

    Yes, Occam's Razor is for fools. I see your point now.

    Our hearts go out to that poor child.

    Greater love hath no man than to publicly and repeatedly question another's parentage behind the safety of internet psuedonyms.

    It's the tendency of people like you to "project" your attitude toward unfortunates like Trig, as well as the homeless, the helpless, and the needy, by saying we who disagree with you "hate".

    Surely if there is anything that can be inferred from my mockery of people who, out of hatred for the mother of a child with Down Syndrome, use that child as a tool for their hate, it is that I myself hate children, the poor, the needy, the homeless, and the helpless.

    Just out of curiosity: Ron Paul, 9/11, moon landing, flat Earth? I just want to know where you're coming from.











  • danmclaughlin
    So, a lot of women you know have two children 8 months apart?
  • hrh
    Trig and Tripp were not born eight months apart. Trig was born in Jan or Feb; Tripp about a year later. No exact dates known because of the bizarre antics of $arah to maintain cover up.

    And we do not know the two children have the same biological mother; not that it matters, as it is not our business.

    $arah's neverending lies are, the really big one re Trig especially.

    To think, this mentally ill pathological liar with Narcissistic Personality Disorder (and Gawd only knows what else) could have been a heartbeat away from the Presidency. Scary, very scary.

    There is a mountain of evidence $arah is NOT Trig's biological mother, available to all...........except those who will not see.







  • CSBadeaux
    No exact dates known because of the bizarre antics of $arah to maintain cover up.

    You wrote that wrong. It should be

    No exact dates known by me because of my belief that the stated dates are lies and because I have to believe in UFOs, Bigfoot, 9/11 Truth, and a cover up.

    There. Better.
  • hrh
    I did not write that incorrectly. We know that $arah is lying not only when her lips are moving, but when her ghostwriter is writing. So why should anyone with a functioning brain believe ANYTHING coming from her?

    You do not know what else I believe, except that you now know that I not only believe, but know, you are a fool. Which flavor Kool-Aid are you ODing on this month?

    None so blind as those who will not see.
  • CSBadeaux
    Actually, someone who gouges out his own eyes and proclaims that the world is hiding from him is actually and truly blind, and kinda thick, too.

    By the way, Oedipus: They used Flavor Aid at Jonestown. Overdosing on Kool-Aid will cause you an increased waistline, nothing more.
  • danmclaughlin
    Amazing how easy it is to win arguments when you get to make up your own facts.
  • KarenJ
    Looking at it from the other direction:

    Lalalalalalala....we don't believe any of these stories because our Sarah who is so much like us is all that is good and pure, and she will lead us to the promised land and be our President...I sent $100 to SarahPAC but haven't gotten my signed book yet...I'm sending more each week out of the grocery money, I've been feeding my family rice...

    The above are actual quotes from Facebook comments by Sarah Palin's fans.
  • CSBadeaux
    Lalalalalalala ... What evidence do you have that proves Sarah Palin is the biological mother of Trig Palin? ... Trig and Tripp were not born eight months apart. Trig was born in Jan or Feb; Tripp about a year later. No exact dates known because of the bizarre antics of $arah to maintain cover up. ... It's the tendency of people like you to "project" your attitude toward unfortunates like Trig, as well as the homeless, the helpless, and the needy, by saying we who disagree with you "hate". ... Your diatribe about Andrew Sullivan's quest for truth regarding the fake "fifth pregnancy" of Sarah Palin is a textbook example of what most neoconservative bloggers consider discourse ... Getting back to the topic at hand, one doesn't have to be licensed to deliver babies to look at Palin's flat belly March 5, 2008 and declare "we never realized she was pregnant". ... Another thing, why won't Ms. Palin sue all of these people who know for a FACT that she didn't give birth to Trig. You know why she won't because she will have to produce documentation to prove that she gave birth to him and she cannot. ... Truly, have you heard about the D-day invasion ?? Perhaps you are familiar with the Manhattan Project ? I don't think they were widely discussed during their years of planning. ... Too bad the toadies in the corporate media refuse to touch this. They will be working off their shame for a long time when her deception is finally exposed, just as they are now doing the same with their blind acceptance of Cheney administration lies for eight years, especially the invasion and occupation of Iraq.

    The above are actual quotes from comments in this thread by people deranged by Sarah Palin.
  • reesie
    I didn't see any mention about anyone having two children 8 months apart.
  • drpatois
    I am not sure how your comment applies to mine. I wrote nothing about who the biological mother of Trig is only who is not.
  • vanderleun
    Two things need to go in the mix when it comes to looking at Sullivan's decline.

    1) 90% certainty of being abused as a small boy.

    2) Huge daily intake of drug cocktail due to HIV+ status.
  • hrh
    And your evidence for these two "facts" is, what?
  • CSBadeaux
    There is a mountain of evidence of these things, available to all...........except those who will not see.
  • KarenJ
    Links, please. Back up YOUR claims -- we did ours.
  • CSBadeaux
    Rhetoric wasn't your strong point, was it?
  • easyliving1
    Anytime you CAPITOLIZE a word you WIN the DEBATE, duh. NOW prove the Alaska bloggers wrong if you CAN, but you CAN'T because you're not even IN Alaska so SARAH PALIN IS SHE-DEVIL stealing PRADA clothes with your campaign donations illegally and she lies about it to cover it up and cover up her fake pregancy too and what about Levi's mom's drugs huh?
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- March 17, 2010 -

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